South Park Animator's New Toon!

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Sat Dec 4, 2004 11:40:27 AM #10496 Perm Link

Spread the word; Animator from the South Park Movie, Frank Sudol, has a new, fully animated Comedy Cartoon series called 'The Chicken ChopShop'. http://www.chickenchopshop.com. Funny stuff.

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Aron Schatz

2014: Year of change. Joined: August 3, 2001 Status: Offline Posts: 10753 Rep:

Re: South Park Animator's New Toon!

Sat Dec 4, 2004 6:34:27 PM #10497 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10496

Welcome to the site.

Never seen the movie, but if it is like the TV Shows... there is hardly any animation to the cartoon.

2014 is going to be a good year. More content, more streamlining. Be a part of history!

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

RE:

Sun Dec 5, 2004 6:18:54 AM #10498 Perm Link

The Chicken ChopShop is a fully animated, comedy action cartoon with enough originality to separate itself considerably from South Park. The animation is definitely better, nothing against SP's style of course.

thanks

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re[2]: E:

Sat Dec 11, 2004 3:29:48 PM #10531 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10498

Said By chickenchop4
The Chicken ChopShop is a fully animated, comedy action cartoon with enough originality to separate itself considerably from South Park. The animation is definitely better, nothing against SP's style of course.

thanks

I watched some of the vids. Chickens avoiding obstacles...some chickens die. It looks like a video game. In fact, it looks like it could be a fun video game if made right...but it's dogshit as a cartoon. The videos I watched didn't even make me crack a smile, let alone laugh.

And, is this what passes for "fully animated" nowadays? "The Iron Giant" or "Finding Nemo" are what i'd consider to be "fully animated". South Park and stuff like this is just a step above the average flash cartoon.

Not that South Park isn't a good show. It's has had its moments of brilliance...I love the movie...

No offense to you, it's just my opinion.

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[3]: E:

Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:45:56 AM #10563 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10531

You have a point about the non-funny parts shown online. Those are more like action segments, like a video game, yes. 'Fully' animated in the sense that it's a cartoon in motion throughout the whole show. Okay, 'fully' is probably too strong of a word. 'Full of it' might be better. But it is a funny show once you get to see the whole thing. But then that depends on what you think is funny. If you like 'stupid' funny, then you'll laugh, but probably not at the online clips which are more action focused.

But seriously, thanks for the comments, good or bad. It would make a fun video game, true.

-fs

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re[4]: E:

Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:52:17 AM #10564 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10563

Said By chickenchop4
You have a point about the non-funny parts shown online. Those are more like action segments, like a video game, yes. 'Fully' animated in the sense that it's a cartoon in motion throughout the whole show. Okay, 'fully' is probably too strong of a word. 'Full of it' might be better. But it is a funny show once you get to see the whole thing. But then that depends on what you think is funny. If you like 'stupid' funny, then you'll laugh, but probably not at the online clips which are more action focused.

But seriously, thanks for the comments, good or bad. It would make a fun video game, true.

-fs

I'm actually very impressed at your retort. You managed to read a post and respond/defend both intelligently and politely.

Glad to have you on the site.

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Aron Schatz

2014: Year of change. Joined: August 3, 2001 Status: Offline Posts: 10753 Rep:

Re[4]: E:

Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:07:41 AM #10565 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10563

I agree with Rude that the cartoon is pretty much dogshit.

That being said, I also agree with him that your response was well written and intelligent. Many members need to follow that example.

2014 is going to be a good year. More content, more streamlining. Be a part of history!

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Nigel Tufnel

Joined: December 21, 2002 Status: Offline Posts: 963 Rep:

(No Title)

Tue Dec 14, 2004 12:51:36 PM #10566 Perm Link

yeah unlike that philcool character or whatever.

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

RE:

Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:20:38 PM #10572 Perm Link

In response to Nigel Tufnel #10566

"Dogshit". Well, I guess that's better than most other kinds of shit. At least I know the flies like it. But seriously, what sucks about it other than the fact it's not funny? Feedback will really help. Thanks!

-fs

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Aron Schatz

2014: Year of change. Joined: August 3, 2001 Status: Offline Posts: 10753 Rep:

Re[2]: E:

Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:35:15 PM #10573 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10572

When you say the animators of Southpark made this; right off the bat it is putting it down. Southpark is good because of the writers!

Second, from what I've seen on that website, the show is extremely not funny due to the fact that the whole point seems to be how chickens just get killed in various (and random) ways. The animation is not fluid enough for my tastes, it looks a bit overdrawn. The other problem is that there is no point for me to watch it. Even Southpark has some moral issue with each episode, or a plot for that matter.

This is not a personal attack, so please don't take it as such.

2014 is going to be a good year. More content, more streamlining. Be a part of history!

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[3]: E:

Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:27:20 PM #10575 Perm Link

In response to Aron Schatz #10573

Thanks for the feedback. So I should probably cool down with the South Park thing, considering I was only an additional animator. I figure nobody would pay attention to this otherwise, until I mention my work on SP. Unless they really like chickens... All 3 of them out there.

I agree, just having chickens getting chopped a hundred ways isn't that great. I'll definitely work on revealing (online) more of the plot from each episode, which gets pretty in depth well beyond just avoiding processing machines. There's a lot that happens inside the ChopShop, with the story and characters that I should probably make more clear right off the bat. There's a moral to each 23 minute episode. I'm working on the 6th one now.

Considering the style, the animation won't get much better, but that's a good comment. Of course you could be very right about this show being dogshit, but I will give it a try regardless.

Thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts, which help a lot.

Thanks again!

-fs

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Whoah, wait a minute...

Wed Dec 15, 2004 9:24:50 AM #10578 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10575

It's your stuff?!

Considering you've taken a bit of a beating in here, it's only fair that I give you some positives:

1. Your answers to our posts are pretty funny. ("dogshit?..at least the flies like it...") so maybe there's hope in the cartoon. I would definitely suggest swapping those action sequence clips with some jokes from the show. Out of context, they just look like clips from a video game. The show may be decent if your wit is as sharp in the show as it seems to be here.

2. The detail in the 'toon is pretty nice and the overall look is fairly unique. I think the problem is the direction you've taken the website. It makes the cartoon seem pretty pointless. Again, add clips of some jokes and tell us when you do so. Then we'll hit you up with another review.

3. Don't distance yourself from South Park. You should be proud of the work you've done there, and there's nothing wrong with sparking interest in your project by letting people know "where you're coming from."

I admire your restraint in responding to our scathing reviews, and I think that if you show some better parts of the show, our feelings may change for the better. Don't despair. As I said, your jokes posted to our comments on this site show you ARE more than an animator and are actually a pretty funny guy...

And, hey, if it doesn't work out, you could always animate my crappy looking "Safe Mode" comic here. (;

Best of luck!

Edited at Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:30:04 PM

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re: Whoah, wait a minute...

Wed Dec 15, 2004 10:34:43 PM #10586 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10578

RudeMoody,

Thanks for the comments. Great suggestions by the way, which I will definitely consider and apply to the site when I get a chance. I'll add some of the 'comical' clips in the animation page soon... Now only if I can find some.

So you said you have a comic called Safe Mode. Let me know where I can find it and I'll check it out.

The cool thing is, it's good to get a point of view from people I don't know. I learn must faster with criticism than with compliments. So if you think it sucks, let it rip, I can take it. Thanks Rude. I'll post when I've made the changes to the site worth noting.

Later,
-FS

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re: Safe Mode

Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:33:35 PM #10587 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10575

Rude,

Not bad at all. I checked out Safe Mode right here on ASE. There's some good jokes in there. The intro started slow, but I realize that's just to introduce the cast. Funny parts: The boss takes a '2 hour dump', the person on the phone who wants to know where the dashes in the 1-800 number are at, and a number of others. Good laugh. Thanks. I didn't get a chance to check them all out, but pretty good stuff for your spare time. Of course the more you work on it, the better you get. Keep it up, you never know where it can take you. It reminds me a little of Dr. Katz on Comedy Central. I personally thought that show was funny when it was on back in the 90's, and your drawings have a similar look, which I like.

Just heard the Dangerous Girl track from thejessieproject.com. Sounds solid. I'd hear more if I wasn't on a dial up, but it takes forever to load. The song works well. The main music track delivers a pretty catchy melody, from somebody who knows their stuff. The laid back singing adds a nice contrast to the beats, and it works. The more I listen, the more I like it. Great job. The chorus parts sound cool. I'll have to listen to some other tracks when I get a chance.

You know, I think with a song like this, and if the Jessie Project is mostly electronic in style, you could approach a small label like metropolis-records.com with your demo, if you haven't already done so. I'm sure you've heard of Front Line Assembly, VAC, Numb and a number of other Industrial acts. Good luck. That ending to the song is some funny shit too, was that you Rude? So do you create all the music for the band?

-fs

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re[2]: Safe Mode

Thu Dec 16, 2004 1:03:03 AM #10588 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10587

Said By chickenchop4
Rude,

Not bad at all. I checked out Safe Mode right here on ASE. There's some good jokes in there. The intro started slow, but I realize that's just to introduce the cast. Funny parts: The boss takes a '2 hour dump', the person on the phone who wants to know where the dashes in the 1-800 number are at, and a number of others. Good laugh. Thanks. I didn't get a chance to check them all out, but pretty good stuff for your spare time. Of course the more you work on it, the better you get. Keep it up, you never know where it can take you. It reminds me a little of Dr. Katz on Comedy Central. I personally thought that show was funny when it was on back in the 90's, and your drawings have a similar look, which I like.

Just heard the Dangerous Girl track from thejessieproject.com. Sounds solid. I'd hear more if I wasn't on a dial up, but it takes forever to load. The song works well. The main music track delivers a pretty catchy melody, from somebody who knows their stuff. The laid back singing adds a nice contrast to the beats, and it works. The more I listen, the more I like it. Great job. The chorus parts sound cool. I'll have to listen to some other tracks when I get a chance.

You know, I think with a song like this, and if the Jessie Project is mostly electronic in style, you could approach a small label like metropolis-records.com with your demo, if you haven't already done so. I'm sure you've heard of Front Line Assembly, VAC, Numb and a number of other Industrial acts. Good luck. That ending to the song is some funny shit too, was that you Rude? So do you create all the music for the band?

-fs

Yeah, I do all the music and lyrics...the end of "dangerous girl" is me, all right. (;..check out DEADEYE and BREAK THE RADIO, they're the 2 most popular songs at the moment...thanks for the feedback!

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[3]: Chicken ChopShop

Fri Dec 17, 2004 9:51:23 AM #10601 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10588

I have some new talking animation clips up at chickenchopshop.com, which show more of the storyline and characters. They're humorous, but as far as funny, that's questionable. Originally, I designed the show as an action toon more than anything. Intentionally being funny was less the focus in the cartoon. So why do I say it's an action comedy? Only cause I had a couple people who saw the first two completed episodes tell me it was 'funny', when that was never the goal initially.

If Rude, Aron or anybody else gets a chance, let me know what you think of the speaking clips where the characters talk. I appreciate your opinions. Of course not all the speaking clips are meant to be funny, just a couple of them. Or none of them, depending on who's watching.

Thanks,

-fs

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[3]:

Fri Dec 17, 2004 10:16:08 AM #10602 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10588

Rude,

I got a chance to hear 'Dead Eye' and 'Break the Radio'. Dead Eye rocks. I didn't get into BtR till you kicked in the up tempo beats at 2 m 30 seconds or so. Dead Eye definitely is the style I enjoy more, though BtR has some good ideas, I just didn't get into the monotone melody like your other songs, not until 2m 30s into it. What did I enjoy about Dead Eye so much? The drums, the melody, and the vocals were all cool and really well done. The song's beats really draw the listener in for sure. The verses and chorus both are catchy too. Of course this is all coming from the goof who created a 'dogshit' of a cartoon, so take it for what it's worth. I'm not trying to get on your good side by saying something's cool. But Dead Eye is a really cool song in my opinion, and Dangerous Girl isn't far behind. To give you a perspective as to what kinda stuff I listen to; (in no particular order) NIN, Numb, Front Line Assembly, Chevelle, Tool, Korn, VAC, Rob Zombie, Breaking Benjamin, Prodigy, Mudvayne, Linkin Park, Saliva, Seether and a bunch of others.

I'll check out your other stuff over time, and look forward to the day you bring a CD onto store shelves. You obviously have the talent necessary to do it. Keep it up and hang in there when nobody gives your tunes a chance.

I do the music for the Chicken ChopShop, and in Episode 4, I change things up from the orchestral themes to more of a electronic theme, just to keep on the subject of the ccs cartoon post.

Later,

-fs

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re[4]: e[3]:

Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:10:34 PM #10605 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10602

Said By chickenchop4
Rude,

I got a chance to hear 'Dead Eye' and 'Break the Radio'. Dead Eye rocks. I didn't get into BtR till you kicked in the up tempo beats at 2 m 30 seconds or so. Dead Eye definitely is the style I enjoy more, though BtR has some good ideas, I just didn't get into the monotone melody like your other songs, not until 2m 30s into it. What did I enjoy about Dead Eye so much? The drums, the melody, and the vocals were all cool and really well done. The song's beats really draw the listener in for sure. The verses and chorus both are catchy too. Of course this is all coming from the goof who created a 'dogshit' of a cartoon, so take it for what it's worth. I'm not trying to get on your good side by saying something's cool. But Dead Eye is a really cool song in my opinion, and Dangerous Girl isn't far behind. To give you a perspective as to what kinda stuff I listen to; (in no particular order) NIN, Numb, Front Line Assembly, Chevelle, Tool, Korn, VAC, Rob Zombie, Breaking Benjamin, Prodigy, Mudvayne, Linkin Park, Saliva, Seether and a bunch of others.

I'll check out your other stuff over time, and look forward to the day you bring a CD onto store shelves. You obviously have the talent necessary to do it. Keep it up and hang in there when nobody gives your tunes a chance.

I do the music for the Chicken ChopShop, and in Episode 4, I change things up from the orchestral themes to more of a electronic theme, just to keep on the subject of the ccs cartoon post.

Later,

-fs

Thanks for the reviews. I really don't expect everyone to like every (or any) song, I make the tunes to entertain myself first. But often I have people who really "click" with the stuff i've made and it's very inspiring. Our live show went really well last month, and we've gotten positive feedback via emails and at our myspace site... http://www.myspace.com/thejessieproject ...Best of all, me and Jessie have a lot of fun constructing and recording the songs together...that's what it's about to me...havin' a good time and rocking out to some cool tunes while i make 'em...

thanks again, and good luck with your stuff, too.

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re[4]: Chicken ChopShop

Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:55:43 PM #10608 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10601

Said By chickenchop4
I have some new talking animation clips up at chickenchopshop.com, which show more of the storyline and characters. They're humorous, but as far as funny, that's questionable. Originally, I designed the show as an action toon more than anything. Intentionally being funny was less the focus in the cartoon. So why do I say it's an action comedy? Only cause I had a couple people who saw the first two completed episodes tell me it was 'funny', when that was never the goal initially.

If Rude, Aron or anybody else gets a chance, let me know what you think of the speaking clips where the characters talk. I appreciate your opinions. Of course not all the speaking clips are meant to be funny, just a couple of them. Or none of them, depending on who's watching.

Thanks,

-fs

Since you said you intended it to be an "action toon"...i'd say...well, you've accomplished that much. After watching the newly downloaded dialog clips, it's obvious that humor takes a backseat to everything else....it's almost an afterthought. I think you're missing a huge opportunity to put some humorous dialog in the show. I'm not sure how many people would be interested in a rather dry, witless "action toon" show starring bouncing chickens. I also think that as an action show, it moves too slowly. Watching three chickens slowly hop across the screen with that overused "boing" sample isn't very entertianing or exciting to me. And, it may have been a better idea to go a little more overboard with the death scenes rather than keeping them as tame as they are now (think itchy and scratchy).

You're a talented guy...but if it were me, i'd rework the show, make it much, much, funnier and faster paced. Best of luck with it either way, and thanks for letting us check out your stuff...

Edited at Sat Dec 18, 2004 12:50:08 AM

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[5]: Chicken ChopShop

Fri Dec 17, 2004 8:10:14 PM #10612 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10608

Hey Rude,

Thanks for the response. Faster and Funnier would be a good route to take for my future projects. Of course there's always someone out there who might like this... Who knows, maybe some demented kids might like this. I mean, look at all the crap out there that's successful? I'll pitch this idea around some more, but I'll definitely keep your reviews in mind if things don't pan out. An unbiased eye really puts things in perspective.
Okay, well, keep up the great tunes and thanks for taking the time to post your opinions, which have done a lot of good for me, no really.

Later,

Frank

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re[6]: Chicken ChopShop

Fri Dec 17, 2004 9:34:25 PM #10615 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10612

Said By chickenchop4
Hey Rude,

Thanks for the response. Faster and Funnier would be a good route to take for my future projects. Of course there's always someone out there who might like this... Who knows, maybe some demented kids might like this. I mean, look at all the crap out there that's successful? I'll pitch this idea around some more, but I'll definitely keep your reviews in mind if things don't pan out. An unbiased eye really puts things in perspective.
Okay, well, keep up the great tunes and thanks for taking the time to post your opinions, which have done a lot of good for me, no really.

Later,

Frank

You're right, that's what's great about the 'net...you probably WILL find an audience who'll enjoy your work. And I do admire the way you've accepted my criticism...Again, good luck with all of your projects...it's been fun.

Happy Holidays, Happy New Year and all that bullshit,

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[7]: Dead Eye

Sun Dec 19, 2004 10:06:52 PM #10625 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10615

Rude,

Still listening to Dead Eye. Awesome dude. I'll load up the other tracks on my dial up soon.

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sam][am

you sneaky butthole Joined: July 28, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 1185 Rep:

(No Title)

Mon Dec 20, 2004 12:24:08 AM #10626 Perm Link

I was playing this demo today on my friend's PS2, I forgot what the game was called but I can find out for future references. In this game you're a fox whose weapon is a bunny with a chain around it's neck...you hit doctors with the bunny to knock them down and get treats and stuff, it's just thwack thwack thwack and the doctor is down in a matter of seconds...it was extremely comical, the bunny moved around so fast and well you get the point...I was just thinking if you did decide to make your future projects more faster and funnier...you should take something as crazy as beating up doctors with a bunny that has a chain around it's neck as an example...it was so amusing that it was addicting to play...it'd be interesting to watch something as equally demented in order to get positive comical feedback. Eh...I don't know, that's all I have.

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re[8]: Dead Eye

Mon Dec 20, 2004 7:16:39 AM #10628 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10625

Said By chickenchop4
Rude,

Still listening to Dead Eye. Awesome dude. I'll load up the other tracks on my dial up soon.

Cool! We've got quite a few live shows coming up in the next couple months here in NJ...

BTW why the FUCK do you only have dialup? (;

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[9]: Dead Eye

Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:40:29 PM #10635 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10628

"...it'd be interesting to watch something as equally demented in order to get positive comical feedback. Eh...I don't know, that's all I have."

Yeah, I played that game. I forget the name, but the rat beat the living hell outta that rabbit. In order to shut off switches, you'd smack the rabbit into it with the chain, as you tried to escape the lab. I remember beating up the lab doctors. It was fun.

I am considering re-doing the show with a darker, bloodier, faster and funnier style. At least just one episode like that would be cool. I would re-draw the toon as well. Similar, but more stylized than what it is. The one I have now seems to be more kid-focused than anything else, which may not fly.

Thanks for the suggestion, which helps a lot! I forgot about that game.

-fs

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[10]: Dead Eye

Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:49:47 PM #10636 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10635

Rude,

Connecting with dial up takes forever. Kinda like watching an 'action' scene from the Chicken ChopShop, as 3 jackass chickens slowly hop across the screen avoiding axes, while you fall asleep. The 5th episode is actually twice as fast as the first, so at least that's an improvement. I don't have it posted yet, but I'll get around to it some time.

In a couple years, I should have all your tunes loaded up with my dial up. I'm considering dsl or something faster.

later,

fs

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sam][am

you sneaky butthole Joined: July 28, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 1185 Rep:

Re[10]: Dead Eye

Wed Dec 22, 2004 12:35:53 AM #10646 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10635

" ... I am considering re-doing the show with a darker, bloodier, faster and funnier style. At least just one episode like that would be cool. I would re-draw the toon as well. Similar, but more stylized than what it is. The one I have now seems to be more kid-focused than anything else, which may not fly.
Thanks for the suggestion, which helps a lot! I forgot about that game. "

That's awesome I'll have to see it once it's done. And, no problem at all.

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

new look to chopshop site

Mon Dec 27, 2004 10:21:26 PM #10672 Perm Link

In response to sam][am #10646

I just created a new look for the site, which is now more cartoony, and reveals more of the story with pictures. Of course, it's still the same show. Plans for an alternate version are still being considered while this show continues till episode 12.

Later,

fs

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RudeMoody

"I remixed a remix. It was back to normal." Joined: September 5, 2003 Status: Offline Posts: 429 Rep:

Re: new look to chopshop site

Tue Dec 28, 2004 4:20:28 PM #10675 Perm Link

In response to Cycle09 #10672

Said By chickenchop4
I just created a new look for the site, which is now more cartoony, and reveals more of the story with pictures. Of course, it's still the same show. Plans for an alternate version are still being considered while this show continues till episode 12.

Later,

fs

Much better.

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Cycle09 Joined: December 4, 2004 Status: Offline Posts: 203 Rep:

Re[2]: new look to chopshop site

Tue Jan 4, 2005 5:16:59 AM #10708 Perm Link

In response to RudeMoody #10675

Thanks. I figure that old look was too sloppy to make a good site. This one's much cleaner and easier to navigate.

fs

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